My Dear Raktaka,
…Regarding the two books you have mentioned, Sri Ramacharitamanasa by Goswami Tulasi Das is not very authorized, and Ramayana is authorized…. The author of Ramacharitamanasa, Goswami Tulasi Das, has a tint of Mayavadi philosophy. He belongs to the Ramananda Sampradaya. They are mixed up combination of personalist and impersonalist. Therefore, the author is not considered as pure Vaisnava. Pure Vaisnava is free from all material contamination of fruitive activities and mental speculation. The pure Vaisnava is simply, purely disposed to transcendental loving service to Krishna. The pure Vaisnava rejects anything which has no pure idea of serving the Personality of Godhead.
I hope this will meet you in good health.
Your ever well-wisher,
A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami
September 6, 1969
(Nothing against “Nayikas” dance group – how they dress and what they do is their private business. Point is that, this should not be promoted in iskcon esp. by a so-called leader of iskcon, Urmila Dasi, Chairwoman of GBC’s Shashtric Advisory Committee)
Urmila Dasi, (feminist leader who divorced her husband in 1996) should choose better role models/images for our daughters in iskcon. It is not the dance group’s fault. It is Urmila’s fault for having promoted this nonsense, publicly on her wall.
Is this the woman who we should trust our daughters with? For them to dress up like that? Moreover, it is the thumbnail itself. So Urmila Dasi has seen this and still she went ahead and posted it!
The following choice of female dress is what is being promoted by Urmila Dasi.
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nadhikuryat kadacana, don’t place women on any position of authority
– Hari-bhakti-vilasa (11.708)
Then what to speak of giving authority to a woman who can’t understand what is Vedic clothing for respectable women.
Caitanya Candrodaya Dasa Not actually asuric. Women and sudras are not allowed to study the Vedas or teach the Veda. In fact it was probably because f the similarity to Vedic thinking the Basu Ghosha Prabhu posted the OP.
Feminism is a cancer. All societies that have empowered women quickly (from a historical perspective) died to be over taken by those that didn’t empower women. But don’t you feminists worry, feminism is here to stay until, that is, it kills the host. Once it sets in it is irreversible ultimately destroying the host society and is replaced by a patriarchy. Examples of such societies are those of Sparta and Rome. For more details see JD Unwin’s “Sex and Culture” 1934, Oxford University press, wherein he studied 35 historical societies and what happened when women were empowered by weak and/or foolish men and then as a result destroyed.
One common thread is that the women became more or less “career women” like in Sparta where women managed estates while the men waged war to the point that women owned 40% of the land. (Aristotle described Sparta as a “gynocratia.”) But being career women meant they could not do their main role as mother and wife and so the Spartan birth rate fell sharply and they could not resupply their army with enough soldiers such that within 35 years of beating their arch rivals Athens in the Peloponnesian war they were reduced to the status of a 3rd rate power and never recovered after they lost the battle of Leuctra to Thebes in 371 BC.
Low birth rates is now the curse of all feminist countries (the West) well below replacement level. This will lead to a “demographic winter.” Also note that countries like China and Russia the governments actively repress feminism and promote families. China just reversed its 1 child policy making it now a 2 child policy. And also note that in those countries there are absolutely no female leaders, not one, zilch, sunya. You will not find a Chinese or Russian May, Merkel or Clinton.
In the meantime “the future is female” Hillary Clinton and the West is waging war against men with anti male laws. 60-70 of university students are now females, the marriage laws are all stacked against men so they don’t want to marry. (The laws favor men in China and Muslim countries, not sure about Russia). Since they don’t want to marry men don’t need big jobs to support family, so they don’t need to go to school to get the job. Basically in the West today men are dropping out of society. It is called MGTOW – Men Going Their Own Way (without women).
This is not new BTW, same thing happened in Rome when Rome was so rich that many women inherited massive wealth and became independent and “empowered.” Divorce was easy and was not favorable for men to invest into since for one they could not be certain if the child of the woman even was his. So men stopped getting married and Augustus had to pass laws forcing men to marry because there was now a shortfall of men joining the Roman army whose might the empire was built on. Rome ended up having to hire mercenaries who after a while thought “why protect these Romans when we can just take it for ourselves.” And that was the end of Rome again as a result of empowering women. The Romans lasted longer than the Spartans but the conclusion was never in doubt.
While the USA which depends on technological innovation to keep the military industrial complex running and thus their hegemony has not only shot themselves in the gonads but now also in the brain. Why? Because under Obama they passed a bill (under Title IX) forcing gender equity in STEM (Science Technology Engineering and Math) programs because it was 80-90 male dominated. So that means many of the most talented males will not be able to get into STEM and instead be replaced by females who really have no interest or aptitude for STEM. And to make it even worse even now only about 10% of under graduates in STEM in US universities are native Americans the rest are Chinese, Indians and other foreigners. So the US already has a serious shortfall of STEM graduates that will only be made worse by Obama’s feminist inspired stupidity. I think you can see where this is going (like the Roman’s shortfall in troops). Is it any wonder why China has so rapidly gained ground on the West?
Again you pro-feminists don’t worry because once a society goes down the path of feminism there is no turning back and it goes to its logical conclusion. The only question to ponder is what language will your great grand children be speaking? What will be the lingua franca? Chinese, Russian, Arabic or Spanish. I mention Spanish because many latinos have invaded the USA.
The moral of the story is: those who reproduce in larger numbers will in the long run win. That will never be woman empowering feminist countries.
Am I thinking that you will change your mind because of this text? No. You already drank the koolaid. It is irreversible and has to run its course.
But I thought they are equal to men, why take ask for man’s shelter? Haha, two faced feminist!
Manikar Das Brahmachari More of her stupid feminist comments are here on this gay discuss post
All Homosex ppl of iskcon have patted each other in the back on this post.
Have a look https://m.facebook.com/story.php…
So it appears that LGTB has now grown to LGTBQUIA and will probably continue to grow as more and more sexual orientations and gender preference choices increase…
Niscala Devi Dasi First you let your friends call me stupid, then you insist I don’t even know what I wrote yesterday?
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See post here
Why let this woman lead kirtans in our temples, when Prabhupada was absolutely against feminism?
Strikes me as not odd at all that these 3 things have been posted by Vrinda Setha the dancer who supported FDG. Ironically they appear in consequetive posts.
Showcases the typical philosophical deviation of the members of iskcon in whose view yamuna dasi’s seva was some feminist rise against the evil sannyasi partriarchy.
Letter to a Godsister
BY: BASU GHOSH DAS (ACBSP)
Nov 18, BARODA, INDIA (SUN) —
Subject: It was brought to my attention
By a godsister…
Home Base: ISKCON-Baroda
Respected Mataji, Namonamaha. Jaya Srila Prabhupada! Received your message:
> Did you read this Basu Ghosh Prabhu?
Well, now I did! 😉 Of course, I’m aware that Malati Mataji is “pushing this line of thinking”. Sadly, she and others, Vishakha, et. al, have “bought into” both “feminism” and “egalitarianism”, which are ideologies.
In fact, at the recently concluded IRGB meeting at Puri, where a paper was presented “refuting” the GBC SAC’s (SAC = “Shastra advisory committee”) paper recommending “female diksha gurus”, during the ensuing discussion, a sannyasi stated that “feminism is due to the abuse of women”.
I responded that “feminism is an ideology” and that “feminism and egalitarianism” are popular ideologies in the West.
Here, from the Wikipedia on ‘Feminism’:
“The term Feminism can be used to describe a political, cultural or economic movement aimed at establishing more rights and legal protection for women. Feminism involves political and sociological theories and philosophies concerned with issues of gender difference, as well as a movement that advocates more gender-specific rights for women and campaigns for women’s rights and interests. Although the terms “feminism” and “feminist” did not gain widespread use until the 1970s, they were already being used in the public parlance much earlier; for instance, Katherine Hepburn speaks of the “feminist movement” in the 1942 film Woman of the Year.”
and, from the Wikipedia on ‘Egalitarianism’:
“Egalitarianism (derived from the French word égal, meaning “equal”), has two distinct definitions in modern English. It is defined either as a political doctrine that holds that all people should be treated as equals and have the same political, economic, social, and civil rights or as a social philosophy advocating the removal of economic inequalities among people.”
The “Vedic” concept is different from both of these ideologies. The Vedic concept is that everyone has a “svadharma”, “his/her own duties”, and those duties are divided according to the concept of “varna”, or “caste” (which has become a pejorative term) or “category” and “ashrama”, or “stage of life”.
“Stridharma”, the duties of women, are defined separately from the above, in “their own category”.
What is the basis of these divisions? The Vedas themselves, the “purusha sukta” and other places, mention the “varnas” and “ashramas”. In the Gita, as we both know, Lord Krishna says that he divided the society into “varnas” and “ashramas”.
A more detailed study of duty, “dharma”, is made in the “dharma shastras” like the Manu Samhita/Smriti. Srila Prabhupada called the “dharma shastras” “the lawbooks for humanity”.
Srila Prabhupada wanted his Western disciples to reside for extended periods here in India to “learn Vedic/Vaishnava/Indian culture”. Part of that learning is that there is “gender distinction” in daily dealings. This “gender distinction” is “innate” in all Indian languages, beginning with the “mother of all languages”, Samskritam, where words (nouns) are (“declined” into) masculine, feminine and neuter.
Here, from the Wikipedia on ‘Grammatical Gender’:
“Many languages place each noun into one of three gender classes (or simply “genders”): Masculine gender includes most words that refer to males; Feminine gender includes most words that refer to females; Neuter gender includes mostly words that do not refer to males or females”
Sadly, Malati Mataji is ignoring both the teachings of the Vedas and the Gita, and the simple grammar lesson herein above. That doesn’t mean that I disrespect her as a person. But what I understand is that she’s misleading herself and those in her wider audience.
She’s basing her arguments on two points. One, there are some letters that were signed by Srila Prabhupada wherein women are addressed as “prabhu”, and two, Prabhupada may (or may not) have addressed some of his early women disciples as “prabhu”.
I’m not saying that both aren’t possibly true. The explanation however is simple enough. One, in the “very beginning” of Srila Prabhupada’s preaching in the West, he may very well have addressed some female disciples as “prabhu”.
He knew that in the English language, the nouns themselves are not “declined” according to gender – meaning they don’t have suffixes (like in Samskritam) that categorize the nouns themselves as either “masculine, feminine or neuter”. Therefore, it may have been that to make things simpler for the “American youth” (at the time), who were speaking a language without “declined nouns”, he chose to address both males and females as “prabhu”.
Later on, he obviously changed! There are innumerable references where Srila Prabhupada instructs his disciples to address women as “mother”, i.e. “mata”, “mataji” (Hindi/Bengali).
Malati Mataji’s attempt is basically one that wishes to change the (Samskrita) language itself!
“Samskritam” can be translated as “culture”, and the Samskrita language and literatures do much to preserve the ancient Vedic culture that Srila Prabhupada desired to propagate.
Rather than attempting to change the meanings of Samskrita words, and thus falling into/adopting “a feministic/egalitarian agenda”, we should all — Malati Mataji included — try to learn Vedic culture and imbibe it.
Vedic culture is prevalent here in India in many ways, as we all know: food, dress, daily habits of early rising and cleanliness, spiritual sadhana, Deity worship, fire sacrifices, dealings with ones relatives (parents, brothers, cousins — as seen in the words used in the Gita) etc., etc., etc.
Srila Prabhupada spent most of his time, and money, highlighting India to his disciples. The Mayapur, Vrindavan and Juhu projects, and the amount of time, energy and money Prabhupada spent in his last days promoting these projects are the strongest testimony there is to this!
Malati Mataji’s efforts seem to be born of the desire to see ISKCON “go the way” of “Eckankar”. [www.eckankar.org], where the “omkaar” has been forgotten, and the “spiritual leader” is “Harold Klemp”, in “suit and tie”!
“Eckankar” forgot their “Punjabi Sikh” “roots” [to a great extent] (“ek omkaar” = “one om”) and “morphed” into a “totally Western” “outfit”. [The Punjabi word “sikh” itself is a mispronunciation of the samskrita “shishya” and so “guru shishya”, “teacher and disciple”, became “gursikh” in Punjab! In fact, the “Samskrita” (and hence “Vedic”) roots of even the Muslim society of the “Pathaans” (of Afghanistan & Pakistan) are on display in the word “pakhtoonwali” [“code of the pashtuns/pathaans”] (“vaalaha” is the Samskritam of “waala”, or “one who possesses something”, i.e. “rickshawaala”, “one who has a ricksaw”, etc.)] And so it goes.
Srila Prabhupada wanted “cultural change & revolution”! Food, dress, nomenclature, religious belief, daily habits, etc. — all of them, he had his disciples change!
One day we will all wake up and realize that our language ought to change as well! Like Israel, where they adopted the ancient language of the Bible as the “national language”, Vaishnavas should adopt the “language of Vedic literatures”, the “language of the Goswamis”, the “language of the acharyas”, Samskritam!
The statement “na mlecchati vai”, in Patanjali’s “Mahaabhaashya” commentary on Panini’s “ashtaadhyaayi” (eight chapters describing Samskrita grammar, seen as the “definitive description” of the grammar of Samskritam) means “one should not mispronounce”,
Samskrita words! “mleccha” means “inncorrect” and Samskritam, the “fully phonetic” “language of the cities of the devatas/demigods” (“devanaagari”) stresses “ucchaaranam”, (“pronunciation”, the title of a book which HH) Lokanath Swami just published, to help Western devotees who grew up speaking “unphonetic” languages!
Sorry for the length of this message. I hope this helps to clear up the sad misconceptions regarding the Samskrita (masculine) word “prabhu” that are being propagated mistakenly.
Hope this meets you well.
Basu Ghosh das
Temple President Basu Ghosh pr. ACBSP speaks against Urmila Dasi’s cheating here
Jayamadhava Pr. ACBSP speaks Against Urmila Dasi(Iskcon Guru Candidate)
her own godbrothers condemn her. Jayamadhava Pr. ACBSP speaks Against Urmila Dasi(Iskcon Guru Candidate)
She divorced her husband in 1996. Prabhupada called this unchaste. Pls dont listen to this woman’s contaminated lectures.
The divorce act is encouraging prostitution, and this should be abolished. (SB 1.17.38) In Vedic civilization the husband and wife were not separated by such man-made laws as divorce. We should understand the necessity for maintaining family life in human society and should thus abolish this artificial law known as divorce. (SB 4.23.25)…there is no such thing as divorce in the Vedic literature. A wife is always trained to be chaste and faithful to her husband, for this helps her achieve deliverance from any abominable material condition (SB 9.20.22)
Generally, separation between husband and wife is due to womanly behavior; divorce takes place due to womanly weakness. The best course for a woman is to abide by the orders of her husband. That makes family life very peaceful. Sometimes there may be misunderstandings between husband and wife…but a wife should not leave her husband’s protection because of such misunderstanding. If she does so, it is understood to be due to her womanly weakness. (SB 4.4.3)
In the modern day, the wife is never submissive, and therefore homelife is broken even by slight incidents. Either the wife or the husband may take advantage of the divorce laws. According to the Vedic law, however, there is no such thing as divorce laws, and a woman must be trained to be submissive to the will of her husband. Westerners contend that this is a slave mentality for the wife, but actually it is not; it is the tactic by which a woman can conquer the heart of her husband, however irritable or cruel he may be. (SB 9.3.10)